Reiki and Sound Healing with Boshko Boskovic
Reiki and Sound Healing with Boshko Boskovic
In this enlightening episode of Going Inside, trauma therapist John Clark sits down with Reiki master and certified sound healing practitioner Boshko Boskovic. Boshko shares how his personal health journey led him to energy work, and how practices like Reiki and sound healing can profoundly support trauma recovery and energetic hygiene. The conversation dives into the science and spirituality behind these healing modalities, the importance of tuning into your own energy field, and practical ways therapists and sensitive individuals can care for their energy in a noisy, high-stress world.
Energetic hygiene is essential – especially for therapists and healers. Practices like Reiki, sound healing, and Qi Gong help clear and restore the body’s vibrational balance.
Your voice is a healing tool – Boshko explains how vocalization and “sounding” can release stuck trauma and support deep emotional processing.
Slowing down is revolutionary – Even five minutes of stillness or connection with nature can help us reset and reconnect with our authentic selves.
Learn more about Boshko Boskovic here:
Website: https://letshealnyc.com
Instagram: @letshealnyc
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Interview Transcript:
[00:00:00] And it's, it's really kind of almost like retraining yourself or relearning how to kind of be within your own self, your own body within these sort of different, um, energetic levels.
[00:00:16] Going Inside is a podcast on a mission to help people heal from trauma and reconnect with their authentic self. I. Join me trauma therapist John Clark for guest interviews, real life therapy sessions and soothing guided meditations. Whether you're navigating your own trauma, helping others heal from trauma, or simply yearning for a deeper understanding of yourself, going inside is your companion on the path to healing and self-discovery.
[00:00:41] Download free guided meditations and apply to work with me one-on-one at John Clark therapy.com. Thanks for being here. Let's dive in.
[00:00:48] Bosko Boskovich is a Reiki master and certified sound healing practitioner by the Sound Healing Center in Sausalito, California. He's the founder of Let's Heal NYC, A private [00:01:00] practice specializing in reiki and sound healing treatments as a certified dementia practitioner. Bosko regularly holds reiki and sound healing sessions at memory care units.
[00:01:09] He also hosts group healing. Sound healing sessions at locations such as Grand Street Healing Project, 14th Street Y and older adult centers in New York City. Bosco can be reached through his website. Let's heal nyc.com or Instagram at Let's Heal. Uh, Bosko, thank you so much for doing this. What else should people know about who you are and how you got here?
[00:01:33] Thank you John, for inviting me. I'm really, , excited to, , talk about what I do, especially, , within the context, what you do. But, , yeah, um, maybe what. People should know about me that I like to share is how I got where I am. I started actually both reiki and sound healing for my own health. , so I had a thyroid imbalance that, , you know, I was doing traditional medicine.
[00:01:58] And then, , I've heard that, , [00:02:00] really working with your own. Voice because the thyroid is in our throat, can be beneficial. So I actually started my certification for my own wellbeing and Reiki two, I ran into a high school teacher that was, . Um, doing reiki, uh, level one, Reiki is for self-care actually.
[00:02:16] So you, it's just for you and your family. And then as you go further into the practice, you can practice with clients. So when she explained the concepts, uh, of the Reiki system, I was like, oh, this is like a really kind of, um, beneficial way to. Actually regulate yourself and your own health. So that, that was kind of like my entry point, , into this world.
[00:02:37] And then one thing led to another, and six years later I have my own practice in both modalities. So yeah, that's kind of like in a nutshell. Yeah. Great. , what should people know about reiki and. What is it? How does it work? , how can it help people, especially in our realm of, , healing from trauma?
[00:02:59] [00:03:00] Sure. So reiki is actually like a, um, a system of, , , of healing touch. Um, it's a touch therapy, although it's, uh, that originates from Japan. It is also a spiritual practice that's. Uh, was rediscovered, uh, by, uh, Dr. Zui in Japan in the late 18 hundreds. , and then it was, um, through one practitioner, , um, uh, Mrs.
[00:03:30] Akata, uh. Got it in the United States via Hawaii. , so that's just kind of like in a nutshell of, you know, kind of like, um, where it comes from, uh, without going too much into detail, , because of time. Um, but ostensibly, I. , it is a touch therapy. It can be done directly on the body or above. Some practitioners work above the body.
[00:03:53] There are certain parts that you only work above the body. You do not, you do not, um, depending what it is. But, uh, [00:04:00] the prac. The client is basically on a massage table, fully clothed, and the practitioner, usually the session is 60 minutes, , and it's done from the top of the head to the, , end of the, you know, physical body, basically the, the feet.
[00:04:15] And it follows the meridian chart of the body like acupuncture does, but not in a minute way. , as acupuncture does more kind of like 12 to 15 body parts and ostensibly. It works with the energy centers, um, of our body. That can be kind of like divided upper body, lower body, and the. Way that I like to, , explain it is that, , as we all know, like our body has like trillions of cells and they all emanate a little bit of electricity.
[00:04:47] So altogether there's this electromagnetic field around our body that we don't see through the eyes, but it really like the body vibrates and when we are in stress situations, when, when there's [00:05:00] trauma, when, when there's like difficult things, the body. Doesn't emanate, it vibrates in a, in, in a much faster way, or things might be stuck as well.
[00:05:10] Uh, and then it vibrates in a much lower, or it's like things are really dense. So what Reiki does, and we'll get that to later in sound healing in different ways, it basically kind of, it can soothe the body, but it can also like open. Vibratory channels and things so that, that are being basically vibrates at an optimal level.
[00:05:35] Mm-hmm. Yeah, that's, that's great. , yeah, go ahead. If there's more. Yeah. So, so I just wanted to add like, the way we live, um, contemporary life. Everything is at a much higher pace. Um, people are stressed out. , they don't get enough sleep, they don't get enough regeneration. We are [00:06:00] bombarded through social media emails.
[00:06:01] People are like, you know, , rarely does somebody like. Start their job and finish and clock out and they're not like reachable anymore. Yeah. , so, so all that kind of like magnifies how, um, how our bodies are basically, suffering Yeah. Through all of that. And, and we don't, um, we don't, , almost like, .
[00:06:27] We get reorient, uh, disoriented a little bit due to, , all of that. So I think that's also one of the reasons why, . Particularly sound healing, I think, , is getting more and more popular that people are going. And we can talk about that a little bit later, like sound baths and things that you kind of like find this container of peace and calm for like, whether it's 60 minute, 90 minutes or whatever it is to just kind of like recalibrate.
[00:06:54] Um mm-hmm. Um, um, there are many alternative modalities that are out there, but I think [00:07:00] that's why. A lot of these things are getting, uh, more traction for people in general. Mm-hmm. Let, let's go further with that. I mean, this is super relevant in terms of just what it's like to be a person living in these times.
[00:07:16] , I've been thinking about this lately and actually having a very, uh, a lot of ambivalence about my phone and just how much, uh, how reachable I am to everyone and everything at all times. Right. And, . What a burden that can be and how that feels. , I'm also someone, like many therapists who is quite sensitive to energy.
[00:07:36] , I'll give you another example. It's like, and I don't wanna touch upon that as well. Yeah. Because I think that there's something, , and there's actually a program that, that, that I started a little bit that, uh, so be, I'd be really curious to, to talk about that with you. I, I'd love to hear about that because, .
[00:07:51] Just to fill you in a little bit on my, my story and Oh yes, please. Is, uh, you know, I've been a therapist my, my whole career doing this 15 some [00:08:00] years, but only a few years ago when I kind of hit a wall with my clinical work and had burnout and was just taking on too much and every client session felt like it cost me.
[00:08:11] A lot. Um, I turned to Reiki as one of the many things I did to try to amazing help myself. Reiki, uh, Qigong. I started a Qigong practice. Even like a 10 minute daily practice started to really change things for me. Reiki started to help a lot. So I am now level two Reiki trained, uh, and kind of loosely integrated into my work with clients, but more so do it for my own.
[00:08:34] Uh, system and my own energy, , kind of energy hygiene, you know?, uh, that's what I say. That's what I tell clients that reiki is actually energy hygiene the same way that we're accustomed to do massage. Mm-hmm. Once a month. That it's in a different way. But we don't think, because back to what I was saying, we don't see the electromagnetic field.
[00:08:53] I call our electromagnetic field, actually our energy field that. Some people are a little [00:09:00] more skeptical about like, wait, what is this? But you carry your energy everywhere with you. Yeah. It's kind of like it's the energetic body around us. Exactly. Which, you know, and they've also done scans. I remember when I first was learning about our electromagnetic field, it makes sense or bodies are full of electricity and uh, you have a field that can actually be seen on a scan.
[00:09:21] Uh. And is yeah. The energy, uh, around you. And of course, that energy bumps into and interacts with the energy, , of other people's magnetic fields. Not to mention if you live in a city like you do in Absolutely. Like New York. Yes. It's just like, uh, I was actually just in New York and is way more, uh, urban than San Francisco, you know, in my case where I can mm-hmm.
[00:09:44] Get out quickly and it's a smaller city and, uh mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. You know, I can. Dip my toes in the ocean mm-hmm. Whenever I need to. Um. Mm-hmm. But how do you even think about that? Yeah. Just being in a city and being around people all the time. Well, yeah, that's something that, that [00:10:00] actually like, I think a lot about, and especially for people that are, uh, more, , sensitive to energy.
[00:10:06] Um, and, and I didn't learn about this until I started doing reiki and sound healing and, and. Energy work, , that nobody, I think this should be taught in grade schools is that we have an energy field and it's through the power of the mind that we can actually create these, whether you wanna call it boundaries or bubbles or things that you kind of actually like, , protect yourselves.
[00:10:34] Not in a sense that somebody's gonna do something like evil to you, but you need to kind of back to the hygiene thing to kind of. Have this. It's a mental thing that you protect yourself so you don't merge with other energies because that will drain your energy or it will impact, I mean, it will impact anyone.
[00:10:55] Um, back to like New York City, the subway system since the [00:11:00] pandemic, um, because of certain budget cuts and things to the city, a lot of, uh, people with mental health problems, , are, don't have shelters that they had before. And the one. Place where they gather because of warmth or a place to stay is the subway system.
[00:11:16] And a lot of, uh, of us inclu, a lot of us in New York, including myself, , take the subway system. So when somebody enters a subway car that has a mental health problem and they're narrating whatever they are in a disruptive way, it will really impact you. And, um, you know, you either go to another car or you just kind of like have.
[00:11:40] A mental way to kind of protect yourself from it. Although when it's very intrusive, it's even hard to do that even with, you know, the mental bubbles, boundaries, eggs, whatever you wanna call it. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. The this, um, I, [00:12:00] I, I think the more you start to tune into this stuff and tune into your own energy, the more you can notice how.
[00:12:06] Uh, easily and quickly and chronically, it is affected, you know, by those around you in the same way that, um, being around someone with, , very wonderful energy mm-hmm. Uplifting. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And you're drawn to that. You're drawn to that. Um, but you said as some, a key thing that was repeated in a lot of my trainings that I, that I did, and it's probably 'cause you've done them too, uh, which is tuning into your own energy.
[00:12:30] Yeah. In order to kind of like. Know what's going with other people. You have to kind of like really start with yourself. Yeah. And it's, it's really kind of almost like retraining yourself for relearning how to kind of be within your own self, your own body within these sort of different, , energetic levels.
[00:12:53] So. Mm-hmm. Uh, and it becomes fascinating. The more you, the more you. Dive into it to see how many [00:13:00] levels, layers, and it's all, they're called for a reason, uh, in energy work, su subtle bodies. Mm. Um, and there are, you know, uh, Barbara Brennan who is like, a big, a big name in this, in this. Uh, in this field has a book and it's called like the, the Seven Energetic Bodies, and they're like beautiful drawings in that book that they actually, there are seven bodies that go beyond the physical body that correspond to the seven, um, sort of like seven chakras, which is like the system from, from the Hindu system.
[00:13:31] So all of these things and, and a lot of philosophies or even religions when you dive deeper and. Dive deeper into that and read, there's like so much crossover of all of these things. In the essence, it's the, um, it's the same thing. And then if you really look at it at the super, um, macro level, it's like, I.
[00:13:53] The universe and how we're all connected. And there's like, you know, modern physics basically [00:14:00] is. , and this can be like maybe a segue into sound healing, , or if you wanna talk about other things is that, um, I. That we're everything, uh, that we're all connected and everything vibrates in this world. But that basically comes from the premise of modern physics, that on a subatomic level, everything vibrates, vibrates, including neurons and, , electrons and, um, string theory and, , quantum mechanics, it, it all basically, um, is, is, , uh, talking about that, .
[00:14:34] There's a connection of everything and how it vibrates. Mm-hmm. Yeah. When, when people say like, the vibe is off, um, like they're literally talking about someone's vibration. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. Or like, I'm vibing with that person. Like, yeah. So it's, yeah. Yeah. That's vibrating with them. Mm-hmm. Yeah.
[00:14:52] Mm-hmm. Yeah, I mean, I would love for you to keep going and, and weave in the sound healing piece. You know, I'll say it's not something that we've talked about on the show. [00:15:00] It's something I have. Experienced, you know, a a few times in different workshops mm-hmm. Healing workshops and yoga workshops and stuff like that.
[00:15:08] But I'm, I'm very curious to hear you talk more about it. Um, sure. So I'll just like, , maybe start with, , um, basically what we just talked about, like kind of like mm-hmm. The modern, the, the vibrating concept in physics. Mm-hmm. But this really belongs to an ancient practice of, uh, sound healing. It's, it's not something that's really new.
[00:15:29] We are rediscovering it. So, , for instance, , in the United States, we know about yoga from the seventies, let's say, , when it has been more popularized. So it's been, let's say around like 50 something years here. But, um not a yoga, which is just one vein or one path, let's say, of yoga is the yoga of sound that, , has been, , around for a very long time and has been, , used for, , therapeutic purposes.
[00:15:56] And it doesn't only use the [00:16:00] um. , sounds as we know it through instruments. , it's also the human voice is a very, um, d uh, that's like the first really like instrument, but also, , through, um, different like mantras that you have. When I, I was studying them a little bit through my certification. I'd like to go deeper, but when you go really.
[00:16:21] Deep, they, they're talking about like, it's really important how you pronounce the mantra if your tongue is, you know, on your upper root because your upper root is connected to your brain cells. So there's, there's this whole like ology, uh, of sound that I'm, I'm not gonna go, , into, but the one reason why I feel that it's becoming sound baths are becoming more popular.
[00:16:47] Because if done correctly, they are a very. Easy way to go directly to the brainwaves and to [00:17:00] actually like slow them down. And once the brainwaves have slowed down, the body actually is able to relax more and to receive more. , but what I found interesting through, , some of the readings that I've done is, , that,
[00:17:17] the ear is much more accurate than the site, actually 10 times more accurate than the site. And when, uh, the embryo is, , forming the ear is the first thing to form, and when we die, the earing the hearing is the last thing to kind of shut off. So it's just sort of like, tells you how much. How hearing is really like a powerful, um, um, a powerful tool and how sound healing can, um, um, can really, um, can really work.
[00:17:53] But I can, I can go in different like directions here with sound healing, , to talk a little bit [00:18:00] more 'cause you mentioned that, , you haven't talked about it. Um, yeah, much. Depends, like I can talk a little bit about. The voice as well, how it can be included in the sound healing. I work with Alzheimer and dementia patients.
[00:18:14] I can talk about that experience, which is, , really super interesting for me and how like, sound and touch also through reiki. But we can, I just wanted to see like where, , where you would like to kind of go from here. Well, my inclination is to hear more about the voice. I'm very curious about how that's integrated.
[00:18:35] Hey, if you're a therapist, I want to help you deepen your client work, help them get better results without burning yourself out. You can do all this by learning to harness the power of IFS. So I want to tell you, we've got a free IFS resource library that you can download. Now, this is full of resources like my Quickstart Guide to IFS, the full IFS protocol, a bunch of demos of me doing [00:19:00] IFS.
[00:19:00] With real people and, um, extra self-care practices for therapists. You can get all this for free in the link in the description, and I hope you enjoy.
[00:19:09] Also, you know, I, um, one of the handful models I use is somatic experiencing, you know, Peter Levine. Mm-hmm. And, um, yep. Mm-hmm. We do some different techniques there with the voice and, uh, with humming and things like that. I do, yes, I do that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it's, it's not a, like the whole program isn't about.
[00:19:28] You the voice and humming, but it's just one of many ways to mm-hmm. Work with the nervous system directly. Yeah. , and really to work with energy directly, although we're using language of the nervous system, you know, in a training like. Therapy, but to me it's all kind of the same, like it's all energy, you know?
[00:19:44] , but yeah, I'd love to hear more about the voice. Yeah. So I, um, basically I was introduced, , to the, , concept of sounding, uh, which basically is making sounds through your voice. For [00:20:00] sound healing purposes through my training at the Sound Institute, um, in South Alito, California through these two, , amazing teachers, um, Lisa Ell and Vicki dod that, um
[00:20:17] have been doing this for, I think, close to 40 years. What I thought was really interesting, , and actually, uh, Vicki Dott has an amazing book. , I'm gonna give a shout out to her. Healing Through Sound Awakening Your Audible Body. . And she's been doing this for so long that she said that when she started doing it, I think in the late sixties, , that um, it had to be kind of like on the dl, that it was so out there that, you know, she was like also a body worker.
[00:20:43] And, , she would do that. And then on top of it, she would be doing these like subtle things with the, you know, um. Okay. Of, of the clients. But basically they opened my mind to, , the concept of, of [00:21:00] sounding, which is actually, , using your voice on a very. Intuitive, kind of primal way first for yourself to kind of like, , Vicki talks about this, um, concept of emptying the body through sound.
[00:21:17] So, , we are all like 60% water and we're liquid beings and through actually sounding through your own voice and a lot of times. That can be stored trauma, stored pain, stroke, stored grief, that you actually, on a very subtle level through the power of your voice, , can really kind of open up things that are stagnant, that are, that are crystallized.
[00:21:48] And, , I forget this wasn't, I'm gonna tell. Personal story, how, um, um, how it happened for me. I forget. I know that it was the pandemic [00:22:00] 2020. I forget if I already started. The, it doesn't really matter if I started the certification or not. , but one night I woke myself up, um because I was screaming in my, um, in my dreams and I woke up my partner and I was like, oh my God, did I, did I wake up my, uh, you know, uh, my neighbors and, and whatnot?
[00:22:22] And I've been in, , different kind of therapies for years, , and just. It was kind of like a bell that something's like really off that. Um, I can't, I have to do something, , with this. , and um, I live close to Prospect Park in, , in Brooklyn and it was the pandemic and I knew that it was like, you know, it wasn't.
[00:22:43] That, , people weren't going as, as frequently, but I went really late at night because I, I know the, I know the park very well, and I went on the highest point, and I just sort of like started screaming, [00:23:00] um, and, and, and doing things, trying to kind of like unearth or it wasn't screaming. First, but just kind of like getting things like out of, out of my body.
[00:23:10] And, and I really saw the more I was doing it, I was doing it pretty regularly. There was more kind of like anger, rage, whatever that was like really pent up from like years, years back. And then I started like really, um, I'm originally from Belgrade, Serbia, so Serbian is my first language and , most of my nuclear family is, um.
[00:23:32] N deceased. I then after all of that, like started imagining talking to my parents, my grandmother that I lived with, like telling them all these things that I never told them that I needed to tell them that, you know, from childhood and all these things. So just. Back to kind of like the voice, how I like, very intuitively started like working on myself to kind of like [00:24:00] unearth all of all of these things that were like lying down like deep, deep, deep somewhere through these channels.
[00:24:09] And uh, , and then through this program really like, and these teachers kind of learning myself to. Teaching myself or opening these channels where I saw that these intuitive things that through sound, can be, um, can be done. So I actually like use them now, , in my sound baths that I do with instruments, I use my own voice to, , to enhance the, the, the sound healing.
[00:24:38] And a lot of times it. It's reminiscent of, , nature or chirping of birds or whistling. Or sometimes when I do the really low, low tones with the Shruti box, a lot of people ask me like, oh, it, it sounds like, you know, uh, Tibetan Buddhist monks or things like that. Have you like trained with that? I was like, no, I [00:25:00] didn't.
[00:25:00] It's through like. Vicki and Lisa that like, they opened this portal that, and, and a lot of times people say like, oh, this sounds like really ancient old whatever. I was like, well, I don't really know. I just kind of tap into it. And I think we all have that capacity. It's just kind of like repetition and practice and tuning into all of things.
[00:25:22] And that takes time and practice. It doesn't, um, and dedication. It doesn't just come like overnight. Mm-hmm. The, you know, the practice of using sound is just found in everything in history, including religion and, uh, singing collectively. Chanting collectively, like chanting Ari Krishna. Mm-hmm. It's like, uh, it's, , it's built in.
[00:25:46] And also for people who don't even know what the words mean, there's something profound about that. Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. And there's something that people just, just connect with, right? It just resonates mm-hmm. Literally in your [00:26:00] body and, uh, uh, figuratively, you know, and emotionally and so well, the, you know, the story about, , that, that night and that, practice of, of kind of using your body, of screaming, of releasing some of this rage of saying things that were yet to be said is really.
[00:26:18] Apropos for our show and what we talk about here because so much of like what gets stuck in us and in trauma, um, you know, of all types is something is happening to me or around me and I can't do anything or say anything about it. Right, and there's a momentary or chronic loss of agency, or loss of one's voice, literally and figuratively.
[00:26:41] That is a big part of trauma, right? And especially when we're young, when the safest thing to do is to say nothing or shut up or smile or say. Yes, daddy. Yes. Mommy. What? Or whatever, right. Or to not tell mommy and daddy about getting bullied at school 'cause that would upset them that that's exactly what happened [00:27:00] to that.
[00:27:00] That's what I actually, I mean, I, I didn't want to go into details, but I was actually like being bullied at school for being different than other boys actually, you know, being a gay little boy. But I knew that I wasn't able to share that with my family because they would, you know, that wasn't acceptable.
[00:27:17] Yeah, totally. Well, uh. Yeah, it's, it's fine. I was just mentioning that example, but it's funny. That's the things happen for a reason. Yeah, exactly. I don't know where that came from, but there you go. , and again, it was, it was safer then, you know, to not say anything. But then the question is like, where does that go?
[00:27:38] Right? Where does that energy. Inside that little boy go. , and does it need to be expelled or expressed or breathed through or whatever sung, you know, at some point. And I think the more I do this work and as a psychotherapist who thinks of clients holistically is, . What needs to happen for them to heal?
[00:27:58] Right. And also [00:28:00] I think all healing arts are really just tapping into the body and the psyche's natural propensity toward healing and the mechanisms, the self-healing that is built into all of us. The way that when you get a cut in your arm, your body instantly knows what to do to start healing it. If we create the right conditions for it to heal and keep it clean and covered and rest and all these things, right?
[00:28:23] It's like, oh yeah, that cut healed or that cold that I had healed or whatever. , and so much of what I think about in, in therapy, in the healing arts, is that right? Even, even going back to reiki, , seeing it as really. It's not something that the reiki master is giving the recipient, you know, uh, like something that's coming out of you and into them.
[00:28:43] , it's is really helping to channel this source energy, this energy that's available to all of us and already inside of all of us, and helping people access that. So that mm-hmm. That really shifts the definition of therapy, right? Because. The, the [00:29:00] classic definition and like understanding of therapy is like, I'm gonna come to someone like John for some wisdom that he might impart on me.
[00:29:07] Right. Some guidance, right? He knows something I don't, or is more sage than me, right? And it's like, that's a, that's what a guru is. Maybe if you go to someone mm-hmm. Absolutely. I, your guru and I'm gonna blow your mind and here's what you're doing wrong and you should break up with him or not break up with him or whatever.
[00:29:24] You know, you have a drinking problem or you don't have a drinking problem, but people. Largely think that's what therapy is and that's what therapy's about. And , it's not, but we have to work day in and day out as therapists to not be put in that position mm-hmm. And put in that seat, you know? Mm-hmm.
[00:29:41] Because clients are desperate for a guru. They're desperate for some to save them all the answers. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Just tell me it's all gonna be okay and I'm going. Mm-hmm. , it's, it's terrifying to not know if it's gonna be okay or not. It's terrifying to be human. Mm-hmm. Facing your humanity and feeling out of control.
[00:29:57] Right. Or wondering, you know, is, is there another [00:30:00] pandemic gonna happen again? Oh, I, it's hard to not know, right. Who's gonna get elected? It's hard to not know. But again, therapists are, we're like, you know, uh, uh, fellow travelers in this. Absolutely. Absolutely. As therapists, we, we let ourselves get put in this position mm-hmm.
[00:30:16] Mm-hmm. Of knowing a lot and having some wisdom. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Or just telling a client what we think they should do. And then all of a sudden we are undermining their agency. Uh, yeah. 'cause if that communicates is you're not capable on your own. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. You need someone like me to come in and be more wise or mm-hmm.
[00:30:34] Whatever tell you what to do or, you know. Yeah. And I think those are like sometimes, um, there are no shortcuts in life. , and I think for a lot of. A lot of people, it's just, , it's an easier way to maybe cope with Yeah. With what's going on. But at the end of the day, we all have to do the work. Uh, I think that's what people don't realize, like that it's work.
[00:30:58] But it took me a long [00:31:00] time like. Now when I do my own therapies with, with other people, I actually like don't look at his work. I look at his as exploration. Totally. And, and it's, I dunno what's about happen here. Yeah. And, and, and sometimes I go and I'm like, I don't know what's gonna happen. And, and, and then there's like the most wonderful things.
[00:31:19] And before I used to be like, really like, you know, I'm going on the subway to my session. It was like, we're gonna talk about this, this, this is the agenda. And that's where I was at that. At that point, but now it's, and sometimes I have specific things, if something happened, but other times, like, I have no idea.
[00:31:36] And it's actually like a wonderful place to be and to be okay with it. Well, that's beautiful. Yeah. And that, you know, I, I train and supervise. A handful of clinicians for the board, you know, so they're in residency with me for a few years and that's something we were just talking about yesterday is the the practitioner letting go of our need to know and parts of us that wanna know how the session's gonna go.
[00:31:57] Or is my client gonna come in and say, I've gotten [00:32:00] so much better this week, or I've gotten way worse. Parts of us are going, oh no, I must not be doing my job. Right. If they gotten worse, if they relapsed or if they got back together with that abusive partner, whatever it might be. Mm-hmm. But the paradox is like when I come into a session, whatever modality I'm using, and the paradox is like if I can release my attachment to like something needs to happen here or something epic needs to happen here, or I need to give my client.
[00:32:26] Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Then if I can, the more I let go that paradoxically. Happens, right? Yeah. And more of those magical and mystical things just naturally happen. And again, it puts a client in the driver's seat to be part of what is making that happen. Mm-hmm. And their momentum and their propensity toward healing and change Right.
[00:32:44] Is um, it's there. Right. And it takes a lot of pressure off the practitioner. Right. For sure. And I know my Nike, um, teacher. Uh, talked a lot about this too, when we were starting to learn how to, uh, yeah. , do reiki with [00:33:00] clients. , so I just, I think therapists can learn a lot from reiki and from this definition of like, what is a healer.
[00:33:06] Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And on, on that note, I, I started a program about two years ago. . Where I go sometimes to different, like offices, , whether they're like with a city with mental health or certain, I had an idea, , I never really developed it fully was like therapist offices to be, have programs where therapists actually get reiki or we have these like sound sessions because you are in the position.
[00:33:36] You care about other people, and I forgot I came up with a catchy title or something like, you know, for those who care for others, you know, that, you know to do these like reiki circles or things because like, especially with the, from the pandemic, like, like I. Every, every therapist that I know, like, you know, their businesses like exploded and burned out in so much.
[00:33:58] So. , and even like [00:34:00] once I went into an office, even when it was like 15 minute sessions with like staff, I would go for a couple of hours in the morning and in the afternoon. Like, it, it works. You know? I'm really curious like. What type of, um, things you did with therapists then, and even I mentioned some things that have worked for me is like a daily Qigong practice, just to work with my own energy a little bit in the morning, see where it's at.
[00:34:28] Um, the thing that shifted everything for me with Qigong was realizing like. Not only do I have energy or this energetic body as you said, but I can actually interact with it and work with it and like move it up and down. Right? Or notice that it's more intense or hot here or here or here or whatever, or here.
[00:34:47] , and that's also very empowering to know you can kind of interact with and move your own energy. Mm-hmm. Um, I'm also like, uh. When I discovered it or started using it, you know, I was living in the Sunset neighborhood in San [00:35:00] Francisco, which is a predominantly Chinese neighborhood. So you have, you know, 105 year old Chinese people doing Qigong.
[00:35:07] Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Mm-hmm. In the park near my house. Like, and I'm always just like, oh yeah, they're doing that weird thing, like playing with. Imaginary balls. Mm-hmm. You know, but then realizing like, this stuff is real and it works. Mm-hmm. It's powerful. Mm-hmm. And therapists should probably have some sort of practice of their own, even in between clients.
[00:35:25] Mm-hmm. Or in my case, as a trauma therapist, you know, I deal with the darkest content imaginable and hear the most horrific details and stories and, of abuse and neglect and assault and all these things, violence. So. Yeah. I'm curious what thoughts you have in that regard with, , helping practitioners.
[00:35:43] Well, I mean, I have some thoughts on that. There could be like little exercises, but what I've done was to either go into a place of office where, , there are like therapists and I would go, like, it would be like a, you know, wellness afternoon or [00:36:00] something where I would just go and I would have a designated office.
[00:36:04] And people would like sign up before I come for 15 minutes lots. And I would have like little time in between and I would actually like talk, I would talk to them like as I would for anyone who comes for an hour reiki session. So they would just tell me within like two, three minutes, like, what's going on that day or what's chronic with them.
[00:36:23] And then I would do like a mini reiki session. Uh, my idea what I wanted to do that I said that I didn't like. I, I need to go back to that. Mm-hmm. To, um, actually, , and, and I know one office where, , you know, it's like a. Big office primarily for, uh, run by, , the LGBT community for L-G-B-T-Q clients, and there's like, I don't know, 10, 12 therapists.
[00:36:49] , and my idea was that I need to follow up with and to have like maybe monthly sessions with them where it's kind of like a mix of sound healing and reiki where [00:37:00] it's, you know, , kind of like a wellness monthly. A session as, you know, you would go to like a yoga studio or somewhere, but you know, I kind of like come to them and they're all, you know, it's just for therapists and it could be actually even maybe like, you know, targeted each month what we kind of like work on.
[00:37:21] Um, so, , yeah. That's, that's great. But back to what you were saying, I think that there can be, that it would be helpful. I never thought about that, but it could be almost like a little, you design like a little mini curriculum for individual therapists where it's kind of like a mix of things that you don't have to go through the training, but almost like exercises.
[00:37:45] It could be like. Humming or, or vowels that you do certain sounding things, certain things with your voice or, or you know, movement or things that you can maybe do within, in between sessions to [00:38:00] almost just kind of like get an energetic cleanse from one client to another, or maybe you do it after three.
[00:38:05] If you have like six clients a day, you do it, you know, in between the morning and afternoon. So you just kind of like dust off what you might have accumulated. Mm. And that could be something like, almost like a, a, , a little, , curriculum that you can do within like 20 minutes or something that it could be like from different modalities that you pick and choose, but you don't have to go through the training.
[00:38:26] It's very like self-explanatory. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. For, for most therapists, you know, this goes back to an insurance thing or why therapy is for many practitioners, 50 minutes, you know, just shy of an hour. . That was an arbitrary insurance thing. But many therapists, even those who don't take insurance, they do 50 minute sessions, which you hit 50 minutes.
[00:38:49] The client stops talking at fif, you know, 10 52, you spend three minutes, um, talking about the calendar, the schedule for next time or. That [00:39:00] credit card that needs to be updated on file or whatever, and then you have three minutes until your next client arrives, you know? Or they're already the lobby. Yeah.
[00:39:07] Yeah. And um, I remember one time when I, , was talking to someone who does energy work, like she, she was astounded that I. I didn't have any sort of practice for like clearing. Mm-hmm. You know, and even clearing the physical space in between clients or if you're on Zoom doing some sort of clearing, you know?
[00:39:23] Mm-hmm. And, again, I still, I think that's something most therapists do not do and are just rushing in between mm-hmm. People. Mm-hmm. But I also know when I go see my, my Reiki instructor for sessions, um, there's a whole lot of preparation she does, you know? Yeah. , but before the session and after and mm-hmm.
[00:39:40] Between the sessions, and that's very. Intentional and methodical. Mm-hmm. And slow, it takes time, like mm-hmm. It takes an extra half hour mm-hmm. Four, five minutes or whatever. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. For her to be ready to do another session and to be feel clear enough to do that. So again, I, I just think there's a lot of therapists that, that we can learn from Practitioners [00:40:00] like you.
[00:40:02] Yeah. Yeah. Um. Got maybe, you know, five minutes left or so. Um, what do you think is missing from the conversation and what do you wanna make sure that people, uh, hear today? Um, let's see. , I think that we touched upon a lot of things. I think that maybe, , one thing for people to take away is to. And I think this is like, um, it sounds easy, but it, it's the most hardest thing I think, is that if we could all just sit a little bit more with ourselves mm-hmm.
[00:40:43] In silence and tune in to kind of be a little more curious to kind of find out a little bit what's. What's going on within us? And then [00:41:00] start, start the exploration, um, somehow, because I think especially nowadays with what's happening, , in our country, everything is so external and we're bombarded with things that we, we almost sometimes don't know how to.
[00:41:19] To go a little bit inward. So, um yeah, however that looks. And that could be, that could be a walk in nature. You know, it doesn't have to be like, it doesn't have to be a spiritual practice. It doesn't have to be an energy practice. It doesn't have to be, yeah. Meditation, although meditation is very helpful, but something that is back to what you're saying, maybe away from the phone.
[00:41:45] Mm-hmm. And the devices and just something that, you know, walk by the ocean or, you know, be with your cat or I, I don't know, you know, something that's. Yeah. The, you know, for whatever reason [00:42:00] people feel like they need permission to do that. So you're, you're giving that permission right now, which I really appreciate.
[00:42:05] Um, I end up giving it to my clients, right? 'cause I can tell there are parts of them that feel like guilty for doing that, or that that would be selfish or that, like, quote, self-care is selfish or whatever. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. , it's really kind of the opposite, which is that the more you. Take those moments, whatever that looks like for you, the more you have to offer the world or whatever cause you are fighting for.
[00:42:27] Mm-hmm. A lot of it in everything that we do consume and even just absorbing media at all hours of the day and from all angles is like, again, where does all that energy go? And it is traumatized absolutely. To see some of the horrors playing out in the world and not being able to do anything about it and feel like why, you know?
[00:42:47] And also like, I, I can't look away, you know, my, my client's like, I can't look away, I don't wanna be uninformed, I don't wanna be ignorant to what's happening, but it's also like, how is that helping? Yeah. But where does that energy go? Yeah. You [00:43:00] know, if, yeah. I think what's help, at least I can just say what's helpful for me, what I've been implementing.
[00:43:05] I'll just share that in. Mm-hmm. What you said last about consuming media is, I also don't want to be uninformed, but I kind of started scheduling how many times per week mm-hmm. Am I consuming the news to know what's happening, but not to be, , kind of pushed into the whirlwind of it all. Yeah. Yeah. And my, my tip would be.
[00:43:31] Mobilize that energy, right? So for instance, I had a client who was very, very, very anxious about. What would happen in the most recent election. And part of how he worked through that was he transformed some of that energy into action, into doing something about it. Right. Uh, I think that's a very good thing to do.
[00:43:51] Yeah. , even if it doesn't mean Okay, he's single handedly changed the world or the election, , there's something about that of mobilizing that is antithetical to [00:44:00] trauma. Right. And, . Again, it's like something is happening and I am doing something about it, right? Mm-hmm. Um, saying something about it, having a voice that is very important for people and very protective for, for people, , versus something is happening to me around me mm-hmm.
[00:44:15] And I can't do anything about it. Mm-hmm. Right? Mm-hmm. That, that is in itself, in my definition, trauma in a nutshell, you know? So, absolutely, absolutely. Wako. Thank you so much for doing this. It's been great. , yeah, I've learned a lot and really appreciated your, your story, especially your personal story as well.
[00:44:31] That was really, . Uh, compelling. So yeah, thank you for doing this and I'm glad that people like you are out there and working in conjunction with people like me, you know, doing, doing psychotherapy. So, thanks again for being here and, and please stay in touch. , speaking of which, let let us know how people can learn more about you and then it a little bit about like.
[00:44:49] The actual offerings you have and the ways you help. Yes, yes. Thank you John, so much for inviting me. I really enjoyed our conversation so much. So, , my website is let's heal [00:45:00] nyc.com. You can reach me on Instagram as well. , let's Heal NYC and my offerings are, um, I do, , one-on-one reiki sessions, uh, one-on-one sound healing sessions.
[00:45:12] And I do also, for those of you that. Might be in New York. , I do also group work, , group sound baths, uh, regularly ev every month at the 14th Street Y with New York Adventures Club and different places that I regularly, , advertise on my Instagram. Awesome. We'll have links to that in, , the description or show notes if you're listening versus watching.
[00:45:35] And , yeah, thank you again for being here and for the work that you do. And, , yeah, let's keep in touch. Yes, definitely. It was a pleasure. Yeah. Talk soon. Talk soon.
[00:45:45] Thanks for listening to another episode of Going Inside. If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe wherever you're listening or watching, and share your favorite episode with a friend. You can follow me on Instagram, YouTube, and TikTok at John Clark therapy and apply to work with me one-on-one at [00:46:00] John Clark therapy.com.
[00:46:01] See you next time.